McCain chooses Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska

[JimHawkins]

Can't say that I disagree with that, Jim. I don't think any politician is a suitable source of politically-relevant facts, but in general I expect half-truths and subjective slants, one side of the story, precisely the side that makes them look good and/or their opponent look bad. Occasionally some politician will be caught in an objective lie (like, "I never met with Mr. Smith." when in fact they did), but more often the word is thrown around by the other side in connection with playing the exact same game with the same set of facts, merely emphasizing exactly the half that is most politically useful to them.

So, I wonder....

Was it different, say, in the 40s or 50s?

If during a debate the VP was busted lying (objective) I wonder how it would have played then....

[AAAhmed46]

Since all the VP and convention threads spun off well beyond their original topics, I figure we need a new thread where we can just fling poo at each other like the partisan monkeys* we are.

*Not racist

Kickin' it off with this doozy:




Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVLQhRiEXZs




The Obama campaign didn't mince words with their response:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obama spokesperson Bill Burton
"It is shameful and downright perverse for the McCain campaign to use a bill that was written to protect young children from sexual predators as a recycled and discredited political attack against a father of two young girls - a position that his friend Mitt Romney also holds. Last week, John McCain told Time magazine he couldn't define what honor was. Now we know why."


Yeah that's right, the McCain campaign just called Obama a pedophile.


The Obama campaign didn't mince words with their response:

link
Time magazine interview

This whole election has definetly taken a turn for the bizarre. If only Hunter S. Thompson was here to see it.

[TSDguy]

Text link of Palin and god's will

[cxt]

Jim

"(lies) is this so surprising....Capitalist Society"

Yeah, cause nobody lies in the Peoples/Workers Paradise of the U.S.S.R, North Korea, China, Cuba etc.

Lying is a wholly "capitalist" invention.

Sheesh.

[cxt]

AAA

OF course there are Christians that belive that.......that is very true.

The main point is that the media/people etc seem to be spending far more time on Palins beliefs than the belief stucture of someone that in my opinion is of considerably more of a world threat.

Komanei was very orthodox--and he felt that particular branch group was so dangeous they should be suppressed.........to me that says something.

Palin made reference to "gods plan" but she is not on TV shouting about the great day when there will be no more Israel on the map or the "United States is no more."

People are spilling gallons of ink on Palin---yet very little attention is paid the religious beliefs of a guy that is funding terror groups, defying the IEAC, the UN, etc and is working hard on getting a nuke.

Just to me seems to me to be more than a little misplaced concern.

Palins beliefs matter to me........but other peoples worry me a lot more.

[cxt]

TSD

Nope......very serious...have little or no credible evidence that Palin "lied" about much of anything substantive.

At the very least, no more than any other politico

Like I said, if "lies" are the problem then I suggest that the problem is vastly and tragically more widespread than Palin....and far worse.

Just your outrage here appears highly selective.

Don't seem to find much on your being outraged...outraged I say..over where exactly Kerry was on Christmas, whose medals he flung on the steps, if Gore "really" invented the Internet....."I did not have sex with that women".......the list is sadly nearly endless....and not confined to any one person or party.

If you want to be mad...then by all means be mad...but have the decency to apply your standards to everyone.

[TSDguy]

What makes you think I'm not? This thread is about Palin. Even though this thread is about Palin, I've expressed my disdain for McCain, Obama, and Biden as well. The problem is getting DRASTICALLY worse. I think the last 8 years have proven such a massive success for lying that the next group of repubs can't help but notice there are no repercussions and that is how to win this race.

[cxt]

AAA

In the youtube ad above on sex ed......there is not even the suggestion of Obama and "pedophile."

Nobody called him that...nobody as much as implied that...its not present in the ad in any regard.

It presents him as a man whose judegment is questionable because of what he wants to fund......which may or may not be accurate.....but there is nothing to suggest anything like "pedophile."

So from where I sit that is a false accusation.......it maybe a utterly incorrect characterzation of the bill in question and Obama's postion on it..........but NOBODY accused him of being a "pedophile."

Pretty sure that the Obama people has distorted McCain postion on some things as well.

[cxt]

TSD

You may well be......but there is differnce between "I hate lies" and "I hate Palins lies."

And when can't point to similar outrage (and hey maybe you can----but the fact that I'm not aware of it is a point in and of itself) on other people screams bias to me.

An outrage not toward "lies" but to whom is lying and about what.

Its reads as selective.

Look at Obama the guy sat for 20 years in church where the pastor gives racist sermons and he claims that never heard anything like it prior...even though the church sells the DVDs of the sermons.
So what Obama expects us to belive is that after 20 years of peace and love he wacks out the one day he was not there and starts screaming "God-damn America" and having said it nobody told Obama and he never heard what was going on from anybody else until the media brought it up?

See that is seriously thin.......and if true BTW speaks to an man seriously out of touch with his own Church and the people preaching to his wife and kids.

Like I said, sadly there is plenty of lying going around--its not just one group.

The Dems swept the elections a recently on the promise of reform...what have they accomplised?
They have been in effective control of the Legislature for 2 years....promised a lot have done little...except to go on vacation right in the middle of the worst gas hike in decades without even offering a solution or allowing a vote.....despite Pelosi have claimed to have a "plan" to deaal with the energy situation.....2 years later we have yet to see the promised plan.

The only way to stop it is to demand honest from BOTH parties.....not look the other way when its "our" guy or gal.

[TSDguy]

That's why I'm voting neither McCain nor Obama....

[Jason Rees]

"Our national leaders are sending them out on a task that is from God," she said. "That's what we have to make sure that we're praying for, that there is a plan and that plan is God's plan." - Palin

There's a big difference between what she says here, and saying that Bush's plan is God's plan.

"I can do my job there in developing our natural resources and doing things like getting the roads paved and making sure our troopers have their cop cars and their uniforms and their guns, and making sure our public schools are funded," she added. "But really all of that stuff doesn't do any good if the people of Alaska's heart isn't right with God."

That last statement is mildly concerning to me. It's a really simplistic look at degredation of society, but almost as offensive is the terrible grammar.
EDIT: I didn't read the article closely enough. She was addressing her church's School of Ministry. I think in that context, her remarks were fine. Being a public official doesn't mean you drop your faith at the door. Especially the door of your own church.

The ad against Obama had nothing to do with pedophilia. It had to do with Obama co-sponsoring a bill that would put sex-ed in elementary schools.

cxt, I would almost agree that TSD seems really adamant against Palin... but I think he's being honest about his dislike for everyone. His love of conspiracy theories, and his undying support for Ron Paul have convinced me.

[Jason Rees]

So, I wonder....

Was it different, say, in the 40s or 50s?

If during a debate the VP was busted lying (objective) I wonder how it would have played then....

Nothing in politics changes. No, it wasn't different in the 40s and 50s, but it was a hell of a lot easier to lie about things and not get caught doing it.

[TSDguy]

You've confused me with cxt and Jim on the conspiracy theories.

And yes, I do love me some libertarians. Unfortunately the media doesn't so I know absolutely nothing about Bob Barr... LOTS of research to do.

Edit: I tease about the conspiracies, but I LIKE having people with conspiracy theories. They're a good start to keeping the powers that be honest. "Who watches the watchers?"

[JimHawkins]

Jim

"(lies) is this so surprising....Capitalist Society"

Yeah, cause nobody lies in the Peoples/Workers Paradise of the U.S.S.R, North Korea, China, Cuba etc.

Lying is a wholly "capitalist" invention.

Sheesh.

Not my strawman, sorry..

I ain't for socialism but that kind of society doesn't have 2 billion commercials of BS per hour like we do and live caveat emptor as a part of daily life either. No culture invented lies but this one might take first place for weaving it into the culture so completely.

[JimHawkins]

So, I wonder....

Was it different, say, in the 40s or 50s?

If during a debate the VP was busted lying (objective) I wonder how it would have played then....

Nothing in politics changes. No, it wasn't different in the 40s and 50s, but it was a hell of a lot easier to lie about things and not get caught doing it.

Everything changes question is how and how often..

IMO many of the thing that pass now would not have passed then. The thought process and trust in the government was at an all time high at that time. Totally different values were the norm.